1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:21,720 2 00:00:21,720 --> 00:00:24,560 3 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:29,960 4 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:44,600 5 00:00:44,600 --> 00:00:49,960 6 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:54,160 This is session eight of the course. 7 00:00:54,160 --> 00:01:02,120 We're going to talk about what is the metaverse, what is a metaverse, what are metaverses, 8 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:07,400 and I can give you the exciting conclusion from now we're not going to know the answer. 9 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:11,120 I don't know the answer, I don't think anyone else knows the answer. 10 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:17,960 So what we are going to do today is, I think ask the questions more than conclude on the 11 00:01:17,960 --> 00:01:18,960 answers. 12 00:01:18,960 --> 00:01:24,880 I also want to say something about scheduling which George and I agreed on earlier today, 13 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:27,160 but we need to announce it online. 14 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:34,960 We have a lot of guests and it's been hard to get the sessions out and get all the guests 15 00:01:34,960 --> 00:01:40,880 here so we're going to extend the course and particularly the time for the guests into 16 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:41,880 January. 17 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:45,240 We'll do the sessions on time and we'll do the guest, some of them now and some of them 18 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:51,200 in January so we can fit everyone in because it's just to get everyone's schedules 19 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:55,840 coordinated but we will go through as planned. 20 00:01:55,840 --> 00:02:02,160 And so as with other sessions, this is a session where we will get some concepts in 21 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:12,640 place and we are then going to talk about then we're going to talk about some of these topics 22 00:02:12,640 --> 00:02:17,440 with some of the guests. 23 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:28,680 So let me, I only have two titles for this session, Metaverse frameworks and Metaverses 24 00:02:28,680 --> 00:02:36,600 with a question mark and we'll talk about what these might be. 25 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:45,840 So, it's clear that there is now much more interest in Metaverse than there has been 26 00:02:45,840 --> 00:02:46,840 historically. 27 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:55,400 This is the Google Trends data from 2004 and basically it's a flat line on the floor 28 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:58,320 until basically last year. 29 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:06,640 And some interest picked up, then Facebook announced changing their name, etc. 30 00:03:06,640 --> 00:03:17,400 interest shot up and has now pulled off a little bit, but at hugely higher levels than 31 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:18,920 we were before. 32 00:03:18,920 --> 00:03:28,760 And so I think it is fair to say that it is a topic that has now attracted a lot of interest. 33 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:32,760 It is a topic that has attracted interest from civilians. 34 00:03:32,760 --> 00:03:40,480 I mean, it's interesting because I think some of us, you know, people with a more sci-fi 35 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:47,960 type orientation have considered the Metaverse to be kind of an obvious thing for forever. 36 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:51,040 I mean, decades. 37 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:58,160 But you can see from the Google Search data that this has absolutely not been the case 38 00:03:58,160 --> 00:03:59,160 in general. 39 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:08,080 You know, civilian interest in the Metaverse is maybe 12 to 18 months old. 40 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:09,560 It's a great, 41 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:25,160 so we're going to have a Metaverse and the interesting thing is, I think as many people 42 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:31,960 as have written or spoken about the Metaverse as many people have written as one of those, 43 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:33,960 that's how many definitions are the Metaverse 44 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:38,400 and it's very interesting because I mean, I don't think any of them are right, but also 45 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:40,960 I don't think any of them are wrong. 46 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:43,000 And I want to go through these aren't you going to read these 47 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:47,040 because I think these are very interesting because they give you a sense of the different 48 00:04:47,040 --> 00:04:50,040 ways people are thinking about. 49 00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:56,880 Some people are just hugely aspirational, very non-specific, 50 00:04:56,880 --> 00:05:01,360 it's not a big shock that McKinsey's in that bucket. 51 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:07,360 But you know, the Metaverse seems to be whatever people's imaginations dream it to 52 00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:08,360 be. The verge, 53 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:12,480 it's partially a dream for the future of the Internet. 54 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:16,200 JPMorgan, the seamless conversion of our physical and digital lives 55 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:22,880 and I mean, I think all of these are true, but they don't really give you much to, you 56 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:24,440 know, hang your hat on. 57 00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:28,200 Then there's folks who get much more specific 58 00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:32,560 so we'll see you on that bit. 59 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:39,600 In a time 3D social medium where people can create and engage in shared experiences as 60 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:46,280 equal participants in an economy of societal impact. 61 00:05:46,280 --> 00:05:51,960 Matthew Ball, who has written a lot about the Metaverse, a massively scaled and interoperable 62 00:05:51,960 --> 00:05:59,040 network of real-time rendered 3D virtual worlds, which can be experienced synchronously and 63 00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:05,800 persistently by an effectively unlimited number of users with an individual sense of presence 64 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:08,640 and with continuity of data. 65 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:18,280 I think a definition like this is actually what most people, most civilians think of 66 00:06:18,280 --> 00:06:19,280 here. 67 00:06:19,280 --> 00:06:28,120 I think most civilians, when you tell the Metaverse, they're like, it's a 3D world and I probably 68 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:32,560 have to put VR goggles and I'm not sure how interesting this is 69 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:35,600 and anyway, it's not something I want to do 70 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:38,680 and a lot of people are like that. 71 00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:44,560 And then there's these, I'd say more conceptual definitions where I'd put these conceptual 72 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:48,760 definitions of like the Metaverse is already kind of here. 73 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:54,200 You know, the Metaverse is not 3D or 2D or even necessarily graphical, 74 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:59,840 It's about the inexorable dematerialization of physical space, distance and objects, John 75 00:06:59,840 --> 00:07:00,840 Radoffin. 76 00:07:00,840 --> 00:07:02,960 I like this one, to be honest. 77 00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:05,760 This is probably closer to my view, 78 00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:08,720 we'll come to that in a moment. 79 00:07:08,720 --> 00:07:15,080 And then, Sean Purney, "The Metaverse is the moment in time where our digital life is worth 80 00:07:15,080 --> 00:07:17,720 more than our physical life." 81 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:30,520 I have to admit, if I was an outsider and I read all these things, it sounds like a word 82 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:34,240 salad, to be honest. 83 00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:38,520 It doesn't sound very practical, it doesn't sound very real, it doesn't sound very here. 84 00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:44,360 We'll see how we think about this in a few more slides. 85 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:52,000 Now in this section, I'm going to present three different Metaverse frameworks, how 86 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:53,440 do I figure out a Metaverse? 87 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:59,600 Two of which I stole from UNIC and one of which is my own. 88 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:06,200 And so I'll do the UNIC ones that honor first and then I'll share mine. 89 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:11,440 As usual, I don't think any of them are right and I don't think any of them are wrong. 90 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:15,880 So, the Unichroto reported about the Metaverse for the European Union Blockchain Observatory 91 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:24,720 and formed, and the team came up with a three-part framework. 92 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:29,200 The first part is that it has universal impact. 93 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:37,400 That a Metaverse, like other broadly adopted technologies and the internet, mobile phones 94 00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:41,440 and what have you, are universal in nature. 95 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:45,000 They go across norms, disciplines, cultures, barriers. 96 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:52,400 Some things you might think about is that some more specialized games, Metaverse, et cetera, 97 00:08:52,400 --> 00:08:57,640 might fail this first test of universality. 98 00:08:57,640 --> 00:09:01,800 The second test is persistence. 99 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:07,320 I actually think this is important. 100 00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:13,680 So, here there's a you know, a cohesive and shared experience is created in your world. 101 00:09:13,680 --> 00:09:20,800 I think the mental model here is you leave and you come back and it's still there. 102 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:22,600 It's not a firm rule. 103 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:33,800 And the fire is adaptability, here defined as users can immerse themselves in a limited 104 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:37,800 or significant way according to their individual needs. 105 00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:42,280 It's a reasonable framework to be honest. 106 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:47,920 It's simple, it's straightforward, it's fairly conceptual. 107 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:52,920 Let's put it as one mental model. 108 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:57,920 Then we have a second framework that I call the "Giaglis Framework", 109 00:09:57,920 --> 00:09:59,360 George came up with it, 110 00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:03,120 he doesn't actually call it the Giaglis Framework. 111 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:07,600 So, he's probably going to yell at me that I called it that in the presentation, 112 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:14,760 but since he's the one who told it to me, I have put his name on it. 113 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:23,080 And here is has six characteristics across two dimensions. 114 00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:28,920 And the dimensions one is technological in nature, one is governance in nature, 115 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:31,640 and I think this is really interesting too. 116 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:35,040 This is kind of more specific and more future looking, I think. 117 00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:42,880 And here the technology properties are photorealism, immersive as in persistence and what I call 118 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:49,160 is the governance property, data ownership, openness and censorship resistance. 119 00:10:49,160 --> 00:11:05,160 And his view of this is not that more photorealism is good and less photorealism is bad or more 120 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:17,920 photorealism is more Metaverse and less photorealism is less Metaverse and this applies for all of these variables or all these parameters, 121 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:19,720 it's just a way to classify them. 122 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:23,360 It's a way to say this Metaverse is photorealistic, 123 00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:25,840 this Metaverse is 124 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:26,840 not photorealistic. 125 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:35,960 And so, you start thinking about these as sliders or spectrums. 126 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:38,400 So one spectrum is a photorealism, 127 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:45,640 are we trying to replicate the visual model of the real world? 128 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:52,680 Or as many games or social media or other possible universes don't look like the real 129 00:11:52,680 --> 00:11:54,000 world, at all? 130 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:58,040 The second is immersiveness. 131 00:11:58,040 --> 00:12:08,440 How much are you in this world versus not in? 132 00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:09,440 What's the degree? 133 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:14,360 You know, email is partially immersive. 134 00:12:14,360 --> 00:12:15,360 I sit at my laptop, 135 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:16,360 I do things, 136 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:24,320 I have my email client open, I go in and out, 137 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:25,320 it pings me, 138 00:12:25,320 --> 00:12:26,320 This harasses a little bit. 139 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:27,320 140 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:28,320 I'm never totally out, 141 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:30,320 I'm never totally in. 142 00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:35,440 If you're playing some first person shooter VR game with VR goggles, I'm only pretty 143 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:36,440 immersed. 144 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:37,440 You're not. 145 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:39,000 You're not also. 146 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:42,600 I can reply to emails and cook pasta. 147 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:44,680 I can't play a VR game and cook pasta, right? 148 00:12:44,680 --> 00:12:46,760 So it's a level of immersiveness. 149 00:12:46,760 --> 00:12:49,360 Again, not that immersive is good or bad. 150 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:52,360 It's just a slider. 151 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:54,720 Persistence and here, 152 00:12:54,720 --> 00:13:00,560 George has a different definition of persistence than my earlier definition of persistence, 153 00:13:00,560 --> 00:13:04,640 which may end up right or 154 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:05,640 wrong. 155 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:14,720 Is it always on? 156 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:17,520 Does it follow you? 157 00:13:17,520 --> 00:13:18,520 Things to imagine. 158 00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:20,520 I'd say you had a virtual pet, right? 159 00:13:20,520 --> 00:13:21,520 It comes with you. 160 00:13:21,520 --> 00:13:22,520 It's there, 161 00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:29,800 it's persistent, which is somehow similar to, you can leave and come back and it's still 162 00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:34,960 there, that version of persistent, but it's a little bit different framework on. 163 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:41,240 And then the governance properties are interesting. 164 00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:43,680 These are the types of topics that are exciting to me, 165 00:13:43,680 --> 00:13:46,840 we'll talk about them a few slides down as well. 166 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:54,080 You know, data ownership, can users own the assets in the virtual world and can they 167 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:57,720 take them out of the metaverse to another virtual world? 168 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:02,520 It's interesting even hearing this definition. 169 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:07,560 Someone might ask, what's the metaverse and what's the virtual world and why are they 170 00:14:07,560 --> 00:14:08,560 different? 171 00:14:08,560 --> 00:14:16,000 We'll come to this question of is metaverse singular and metaverse plural. 172 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:22,880 Openness can developers or in my view, I think individuals, it doesn't have to be developers, 173 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:32,720 Minecraft is, you don't need to be a developer to build things in Minecraft. 174 00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:40,440 And is the virtual world open to developers to create spaces, experiences, objects, applications? 175 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:42,240 Is it customizable? 176 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:50,480 And then the censorship resistance, so the degree to which users can be prohibited from 177 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:55,160 accessing the virtual world restricted in their experiences or kicked off the metaverse 178 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:58,800 by some centralized authority who owns or controls the world. 179 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:03,600 Yeah, this is my personal obsession, 180 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:10,720 arguably, I think today basically no metaverse is censorship resistant, and 181 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:15,280 there's always a counterparty that is controlling it. 182 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:25,240 I think this is an interesting and more practical framework for classifying metaverses or potential 183 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:26,240 metaverses. 184 00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:33,600 And I think it's something that I don't assign work to anyone, but it could be, you could have this 185 00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:40,800 grid and put different metaverses in this grid and see where they fall out. 186 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:50,080 Because I'm not advanced, I have a simpler definition of the metaverse, which is my framework 187 00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:54,360 on it, which is just one sentence. 188 00:15:54,360 --> 00:16:03,200 And my definition is, it is the internet with better visualization and persistent digital 189 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:06,600 objects. 190 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:23,320 And this is a quite different approach because I've kind of defined my way out of the singular 191 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:31,320 or plural metaverse question and there's a reason for this. 192 00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:41,240 And I think my framework is going to be more relevant in the longer term. 193 00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:46,440 I think the other framework is great for today, but I think it's more relevant in the longer 194 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:47,440 term. 195 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:50,920 Why do I think that? 196 00:16:50,920 --> 00:16:59,760 Imagine any type of world where we have all these, let's call them "metaverse experiences". 197 00:16:59,760 --> 00:17:04,280 They're persistent, they're immersive, they may be photo realistic. 198 00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:06,440 They follow us around. 199 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:12,000 They're probably AI enabled in many ways. 200 00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:16,160 There'll be multiple things, it won't just be one thing, I don't think it'll just be 201 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:19,440 one metaverse and that metaverse is going to be Minecraft, right? 202 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:28,280 Well, imagine that's the case and it's not today, it's 10 years from now or 15 years from 203 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:32,440 now, or 20 years from now, it doesn't really matter when you pick. 204 00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:42,280 I don't think in that world we will have the metaverse and separately, the internet. 205 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:47,880 I don't think you'll say, "oh, today I'm going to go use the internet and then later today 206 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:50,640 I'm going to go use the metaverse". 207 00:17:50,640 --> 00:18:00,880 I think they're going to become the same thing, just like there was a time, maybe still true 208 00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:09,320 today, that like, mobile apps was a different thing, mobile was a different thing than desktop. 209 00:18:09,320 --> 00:18:16,640 I'm sure the phone factor is different, but I basically use more or less all the same 210 00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:25,440 applications on the desktop and on my phone and, I don't know if that's like some separate 211 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:26,440 ecosystem. 212 00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:30,000 Or here's another way to think about it. 213 00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:35,440 Let's say you're in one of these, for argument's sake, three dimensional spaces. 214 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:45,480 It isn't going to be the case that if you want to have extended conversations or chats 215 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:50,360 with people in those spaces, you're going to leave them and go to some other chats 216 00:18:50,360 --> 00:18:53,280 offer. 217 00:18:53,280 --> 00:19:00,520 My guess is no, today the user experience, the user interface for having chats in these 218 00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:03,680 three spaces is kind of wonky. 219 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:11,000 That's why I was still use Twitter and Discord and WhatsApp and Telegram and all these other 220 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:12,000 things, right? 221 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:20,720 But the idea that again, a decade from now, we have this kind of persistent immersive 222 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:30,000 environment and yet in order to chat to someone, in order to chat to someone, you have to 223 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:34,800 leave it, and go somewhere else, 224 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:35,800 makes no sense to me. 225 00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:41,040 If you're still, if it's a decade from now and you still have to leave the quote/unquote 226 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:49,000 "metaverse" for me to send a DM to George, well, I mean, I don't think that metaverse will 227 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:50,000 be very effective. 228 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:51,000 Is that okay? 229 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:52,000 Well, okay, fine. 230 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:53,000 We'll have you. 231 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:54,000 What about other things? 232 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:55,000 Email? 233 00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:57,760 You know, I'm sure we'll have email a decade from now 234 00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:02,680 but why can't I answer my email in that environment? 235 00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:07,880 It's just a form factor, a UX UI for reading my email, 236 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:11,240 why can't I read my email in a private room? 237 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:16,400 Why do I have to read it in the interface that it has now? 238 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:17,400 Well, sure, 239 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:18,400 Okay, 240 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:20,880 but what about an old studio computer? 241 00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:23,640 I watch a movie, 242 00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:24,640 Okay, 243 00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:28,360 You can watch a movie in a three-year environment. 244 00:20:28,360 --> 00:20:32,680 I want to work on Excel. 245 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:43,000 And in fact, you know, you could have, I assume by that point, you'll have much more screen 246 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:44,000 space to work with, 247 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,200 you might have many Excels out there. 248 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:58,200 So I just, I will be surprised if in the long run you go and spend a lot of time and some 249 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:04,240 type of immersive environment and then you leave it to do all the other stuff you do 250 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:05,240 now that's less immersive. 251 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:14,160 To put it differently, I think the immersive environment can subsume the non-emersive environment. 252 00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:19,120 But I don't think the other way around works. 253 00:21:19,120 --> 00:21:22,840 You can have a 2D chat box in a 3D space. 254 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:26,240 It's kind of hard to have a 3D space with a 2D chat box. 255 00:21:26,240 --> 00:21:35,600 And so if you believe in this, I just don't see any way it's not going to be like this 256 00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:41,440 then, the internet goes away. 257 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:42,680 Now it doesn't go away, 258 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:43,840 it's all right there. 259 00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:50,560 It's been the plumbing of how we communicate in a distance for many decades. 260 00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:57,360 But the idea that the internet and the metaverse are separate spaces, I think eventually ends. 261 00:21:57,360 --> 00:22:00,880 It's an open question I'm willing to concede, 262 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:05,240 but I don't know when; is it in 10 years? 263 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:07,240 Is it in 7? 264 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:08,240 Is it in 23? 265 00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:17,040 But pick any arbitrary, arbitrary future point, 100 years from now. 266 00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:21,320 We have human brain interfaces. 267 00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:23,320 We don't even have physical devices. 268 00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:29,440 You're thinking about something and you're seeing it in front of you directly through 269 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:30,440 your neurons. 270 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:35,040 Are you really going to separately go use the internet somewhere else? 271 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:37,040 I don't think so. 272 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,040 I think they merge. 273 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:40,040 And then they merge. 274 00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:42,800 It's just the internet that they merge. 275 00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:45,800 The metaverse is anyway running today on the internet. 276 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:49,240 The metaverse space we're talking about is running on the internet. 277 00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:55,640 But what's the second pillar with better visualization? 278 00:22:55,640 --> 00:23:07,920 And this concept of better visualization is one that is a consistent theme in the internet 279 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:09,160 since the day it started. 280 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:10,920 It used to be touch-based. 281 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:14,920 Then we got some pictures. 282 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,600 Then we got really lousy video. 283 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:23,240 An old enough term for when video was lousy on the internet. 284 00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:31,160 And today you can watch an HD movie on the internet. 285 00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:40,480 You can do a zoom and you have free global video conferencing on your laptop or even 286 00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:42,480 on your phone. 287 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:48,480 Global video teleconference used to be a big company feature 15 years ago. 288 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:52,760 You went to a special conference room to do that. 289 00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:56,480 And that's showing no sign of stopping. 290 00:23:56,480 --> 00:24:03,480 What I think is going to be the transition now is 3D visualization, the browser, the 291 00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:06,280 probably what is on the next side, 292 00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:13,280 and then augmented and virtual reality belong to them where they'll be together. 293 00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:21,000 I think once the devices get sufficiently functional, you'll have something like a pair 294 00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:22,000 of sunglasses. 295 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:26,400 Those pair of sunglasses will be mostly an awkward to reality. 296 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:31,160 You'll also see the world around you, but also have digital objects there. 297 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:37,200 See your fiddens on your wall or you'll have your Phoenix all spreadsheets floating around, 298 00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:42,720 but they'll have the ability to pop into virtual reality and hide the world around you. 299 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:46,160 And that's going to come. 300 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,440 It's not there yet. 301 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:51,600 I know of no specific person, 302 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:56,200 I'm sure there's some of the world's lessons, but I don't know any of them who wears a virtual 303 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:57,200 reality headset all day. 304 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:01,200 And there's a lot of excitement about the upcoming Apple augmented reality. 305 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:05,720 I'd say maybe this will be a step forward and this is not going to work right every 306 00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:06,720 day. 307 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:11,680 Every year we'll have a step forward where the devices will get more functional, more practical, 308 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:17,120 and we will see this level of forwardness. 309 00:25:17,120 --> 00:25:19,040 I don't think we're there yet. 310 00:25:19,040 --> 00:25:24,160 I don't think it's like next year we're all going to be wearing AR and VR models. 311 00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:39,360 And then for persistence, I think of it about the digital objects. 312 00:25:39,360 --> 00:25:42,160 My mental models that will have persistent digital objects. 313 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:43,160 Now what's a digital object? 314 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:44,160 It'll be anything, right? 315 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,200 It could be a piece of art. 316 00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:51,280 It could be an avatar. 317 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:54,040 It could be a wearable. 318 00:25:54,040 --> 00:26:01,840 It could be a specific three dimensional space in which you do something. 319 00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:06,640 It could be a piece of "land". 320 00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:08,840 The land is different than a space, right? 321 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:16,160 Land implies that there's some type of property that is surrounded by 322 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,760 other property and you own a specific property. 323 00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:21,600 A space doesn't need to be the same as land, right? 324 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:29,880 You can have a space that's not tied to some property grid. 325 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:40,960 And my view of persistence is that they are there, when you come back. 326 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:45,120 Now, where that open metaverse stuff? 327 00:26:45,120 --> 00:26:46,720 Well, it's not in the stuff initially. 328 00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:53,160 But to me as a definition, you could imagine closed metaverses fulfilling these conditions. 329 00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:57,120 And I think for the question over here, what's a metaverse? 330 00:26:57,120 --> 00:26:58,120 That's fair. 331 00:26:58,120 --> 00:27:05,400 There's going to be closed metaverses and they might even win or partially win. 332 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:13,840 So I don't think we can say that the definition of a metaverse by definition means it's open. 333 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:15,400 It might be closed. 334 00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:20,040 We can think about what are the characteristics that make it open. 335 00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:23,880 But it's not like it's a short thing, but it's going to be open. 336 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:32,240 But for me, these three things are the three main ones. 337 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:34,240 They cover all scenarios. 338 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:39,480 That is a less useful framework than say George's for classifying different metaverses 339 00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:40,480 on different dimensions. 340 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:51,200 But it also, I think, is it covers almost any possible inconsolable manner. 341 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:58,880 I want to show an example here because I think people often, you say VR and AR, and this 342 00:27:58,880 --> 00:27:59,880 all cannot make sense. 343 00:27:59,880 --> 00:28:02,480 There is a 3D visualization browser. 344 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:03,480 What do you mean? 345 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:10,160 And this is a very silly example, but I think it illustrates the point. 346 00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:13,720 These are both screen grabs from the browser. 347 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:24,760 And on the left is the website over the museum of modern art, a mobile that has the inventory 348 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:25,760 of everything at the moment. 349 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:27,520 That is perfectly fine and functional 350 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:35,680 and you can search by artist and you get this list of artwork. 351 00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:42,960 And on the right is the generative gallery of the 6529 museum, also running in 352 00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:43,960 the browser 353 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:48,120 but one of them is 3D. 354 00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:55,880 And I think, over time, quite a few usage cases will migrate from the visualization on 355 00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:59,240 the left to the visualization on the right. 356 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:05,920 Now, some things might stay on the visualization on the left for speed and ease of use 357 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:11,920 and certainly we are not particularly ready to go to the right because they are still 358 00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:14,920 all of them are wonky. 359 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:26,040 Even, do I think, oh, which is where this is on the right, is ready for prime time, 360 00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:30,200 retail, consumer use? 361 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:34,480 That's okay, it's still early. Over the course of the next few years, 362 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:42,320 we'll sort out how to make these spaces functional and fast and performant 363 00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:47,320 and people will figure out what is the model for moving around these spaces. 364 00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:51,160 Everyone now knows the model for working on the web. 365 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:55,120 But it took a long time to sort that out. 366 00:29:55,120 --> 00:30:01,560 But I do think there are many usage cases where looking at something with this more expressive 367 00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:03,560 visualization has got to make sense. 368 00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:08,840 And as I was saying, you can put goggles on and go into VR into that gallery. 369 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:09,840 Yeah, that's true. 370 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:10,840 It can. 371 00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,080 But VR is there now. 372 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:20,240 And so it's not, actually, don't think it's the rendering that's hugely the problem 373 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:21,240 right now. 374 00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:23,240 I think it's the devices. 375 00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:27,680 Yes, that gallery, we can see it in VR 376 00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:29,680 and I've seen it once in VR. 377 00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:35,120 And every other time I went, I just went to the browser because I wasn't going to go 378 00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:39,440 get VR goggles and put them on just to go and insert something. 379 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:44,840 So until that becomes easier, I think it's going to be mostly, most of the screen time 380 00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:52,040 is going to be in the browser not in VR and 3D on your browser or your computer, not 381 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:53,040 in VR, we will get there in time, 382 00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:54,040 but not yet. 383 00:30:54,040 --> 00:31:07,840 Anybody definition raises a question, which is a general question of, is metaverse a 384 00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:08,840 singular or plural word? 385 00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:09,840 386 00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:10,840 387 00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:11,840 388 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:25,840 And I'll say as always, I don't know. 389 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:34,800 Nobody knows. 390 00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:54,840 But I will throw out a concept about how potentially, we can resolve it. 391 00:31:54,840 --> 00:32:03,560 And maybe the concept, which I think matters more, my definition is all unbiased, I think. 392 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:11,760 My concept is that today they are plural and that some sufficiently far off time in the 393 00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:16,720 future, it's singular. 394 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:18,720 Why are they plural today? 395 00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:27,600 Well, because today, metaverse spaces are a small fraction of the internet 396 00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:37,120 and so you kind of need the word to distinguish them from a regular website or a regular mobile 397 00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:38,120 application. 398 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,520 It's very clear that not every website is a metaverse, right? 399 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:45,360 And not every mobile application is a metaverse. 400 00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:57,440 And there is obviously more than one competing for this idea of being a metaverse. 401 00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:05,960 So I think today, it's sensibly a plural topic. 402 00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:15,520 If this is correct, but in the long run, the internet won't really be a different thing, 403 00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:24,160 I think in the long run, it's not going to make as much sense that they are plural, I 404 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:25,160 think. 405 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,680 I think the whole thing is going to just be metaverse. 406 00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:34,520 The way to think about it is, I don't know, imagine a kid growing up in 2040. 407 00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:45,000 You know, if you have spent any time around young kids today and you're a little bit older, like 408 00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:54,200 I am, it's a little bit disconcerting that they look at the TV as kind of being a subset 409 00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:56,800 of an iPad or something, right? 410 00:33:56,800 --> 00:34:02,520 A TV is a poorly functioning iPad, 411 00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:13,240 you can't do things on demand and, you know, I mean, linear TV, right? 412 00:34:13,240 --> 00:34:17,840 And then, you know, with smart TVs, you end up getting the YouTube and Netflix and whatever 413 00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:19,840 applications on them 414 00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:24,920 and so, they just become an iPad. 415 00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:32,040 The linear TV part of the TV is close to irrelevant. 416 00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:33,680 And that's weird, 417 00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:42,120 if you remember, like I remember, when TV was one thing and streaming video was something 418 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:53,680 else, so you turn on TV and you watch on NBC, the Thanksgiving Day Parade, it's on NBC or it's 419 00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:54,680 on CBS, however 420 00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:58,720 tomorrow you'll turn on network TV and you'll watch the Thanksgiving Day Parade. 421 00:34:58,720 --> 00:35:05,280 And then you'd go to your computer, to the internet, and watch a YouTube video. 422 00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:15,800 And those were very distinct things and there were whole reports about internet video and 423 00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:22,680 video on demand and over the top video and I think those reports still exist, right? 424 00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:30,480 And if I look at older people, there's the most you watch a linear TV and you're going 425 00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:37,720 to get a little bit on their iPad or what have you and they're still very distinct. 426 00:35:37,720 --> 00:35:47,080 But if someone doesn't have the history and is starting you, the idea of telerestrials 427 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:54,680 or cable or linear TV is absurd and irrelevant and stupid, right? 428 00:35:54,680 --> 00:36:01,000 It's all video and they're just different screens. 429 00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:09,840 I think very abstractly, very conceptually, that's how it's going to be. 430 00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:19,400 You know, once these metaverse spaces are performant and simple to use and in any case, 431 00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:22,840 I believe it's going to be easy to go from one to another, even in the closed case. 432 00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:29,720 I think it is going to be easy to go from one to another. 433 00:36:29,720 --> 00:36:40,600 Then someone who does not have the prior experience of a pre-metaverse internet, I think it's 434 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:45,200 just going to be the one thing that you go and do things. 435 00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:47,200 I'm not specific applications there, right? 436 00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:50,200 And yeah, maybe the one by then is not going to be metaverse, right? 437 00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:51,360 Maybe there'll be something else. 438 00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:54,440 But I do think it's going to be unified in the end. 439 00:36:54,440 --> 00:37:02,720 I don't think it's going to be a bunch of different ones. 440 00:37:02,720 --> 00:37:10,240 Now, just conceptually here, we're not going to get into so much details on each one 441 00:37:10,240 --> 00:37:16,880 of these, but where were what might be the earliest metaverse? 442 00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:25,920 You know, multi-user versions were text-based and they had characters and you interacted 443 00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:26,920 with people. 444 00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:27,920 Immersive? 445 00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:42,160 Anyway, now on George's framework, not in the slightest but photo-realistic, but not 446 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:43,160 necessarily relevant 447 00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:49,880 so we started here, right? 448 00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:53,080 And then we got some graphics. 449 00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:56,520 And shared, shared version, right? 450 00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,520 But then we got some better graphics. 451 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:02,520 And a little bit more of a virtual world, right? 452 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:06,320 This is all very early 453 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:07,320 work. 454 00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:19,960 But I'm not sure they are conceptually different from us bouncing around and essential and 455 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:21,840 or all know whatever now. 456 00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:23,840 How are they conceptually different? 457 00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:30,600 Is anything different other than the graphics are better? 458 00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:33,440 Is anything different other than the graphics are better, 459 00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:40,400 well, maybe now we have NFTs, which is a very specific topic, but for the metaverse aspect, 460 00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:49,200 I think the fundamental principles were already there in this year. 461 00:38:49,200 --> 00:38:59,360 And then I think the very obvious, you know, we come decades ahead. 462 00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:07,480 I think there's an excellent case that the massively multiplayer online role playing 463 00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:13,480 games are in the concept of plural metaverses, they're metaverses. 464 00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:25,440 A bit older, you enter a specific node, you have a specific role or character or avatar. 465 00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:36,200 There's persistence in some of these there are economies. 466 00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:44,280 I would credit them with being a metaverse research. 467 00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:49,000 Even our social layer metaverses have been doing it for a long time. 468 00:39:49,000 --> 00:40:00,520 Second life, very famously, got a lot of traction trying to build a metaverse in the 469 00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:01,520 2000s, 470 00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:04,520 it's been at least 10 years. 471 00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:12,520 I'm going to have to check exactly when it started. 472 00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:22,040 But it's been the same concepts as well there 473 00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:32,400 and a lot of the things we're seeing now with the blockchain based social virtual worlds 474 00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:38,040 existed then IBM is going to open a campus in Second Life. 475 00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:41,160 Some universities can open a campus in Second Life. 476 00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:47,440 Some retail stores are going to open a store in Second Life. 477 00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:49,360 We went through that cycle 478 00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:56,360 and it didn't totally quite stick with Second Life. 479 00:40:56,360 --> 00:40:58,960 Second Life is still up and running 480 00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:03,520 but it didn't take over the world the way. 481 00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:06,440 some people might have thought that it would. 482 00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:12,640 Here's another one. 483 00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:15,600 I ask myself this. 484 00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:22,480 Is NFT, Twitter and Discord a metaverse? 485 00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:29,080 Are those avatars or persistent digital objects? 486 00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:39,880 The world itself is persistent, my Twitter feed is persistent, my Discord feed is persistent. 487 00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:51,240 I come into them and I see the same type of people, characters, etc. 488 00:41:51,240 --> 00:41:56,920 There's definitely an economy. 489 00:41:56,920 --> 00:42:08,040 There is in fact a self-soverign economy because that economy primarily runs on the Ethereum blockchain. 490 00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:15,720 I'm thinking back to George's six factors. 491 00:42:15,720 --> 00:42:17,720 It's not photo-realistic. 492 00:42:17,720 --> 00:42:28,400 But OK maybe I'll it a little bit. 493 00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:34,360 Is NFT, Twitter and Discord and OpenSea and Oncyber and on-central and in some is this 494 00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:35,360 a metaverse? 495 00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:37,000 Sort of, I think. 496 00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:41,400 Is it fully polished and integrated? 497 00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:42,400 No. 498 00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:48,680 Is it a metaverse? 499 00:42:48,680 --> 00:42:49,680 I think. 500 00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:51,680 I think it is. 501 00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:59,880 And it's weird because here there's not one platform. 502 00:42:59,880 --> 00:43:13,600 Here what is to some degree serving as the unifying link is it there? 503 00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:20,680 And is it fully integrated that I signed Punk 6529 on Twitter and I signed Punk 6529 504 00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:21,680 on Discord? 505 00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:22,680 Why don't I sign on Discord? 506 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:23,680 I could. 507 00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:24,680 I guess. 508 00:43:24,680 --> 00:43:25,680 Do it cloud-land. 509 00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:30,680 Do I Oncyber and on? 510 00:43:30,680 --> 00:43:32,880 Yeah, I do. 511 00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:40,640 And so, it feels to me that this is one a relatively more decentralized metaverse or relatively 512 00:43:40,640 --> 00:43:47,680 where the layer that ties people together imperfectly today. 513 00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:56,480 And with a lot of noise, not full signal, a lot of noise, is the Ethereum option? 514 00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:59,560 What's some other examples? 515 00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:01,560 What can I go? 516 00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:02,560 Okay. 517 00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:03,560 I'm just a parent. 518 00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:05,560 Does it have some metaverse characteristic? 519 00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:06,560 Yeah, it's persistent. 520 00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:07,560 Is there a community? 521 00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:08,560 Yeah. 522 00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:09,560 Is it a game? 523 00:44:09,560 --> 00:44:10,560 I don't know 524 00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:13,560 ask this question in a couple of seconds. 525 00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:24,680 Where is the line between any multiplayer game, and I also need this for the massively 526 00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:32,040 multiplayer online games, and Pokemon Go? 527 00:44:32,040 --> 00:44:34,080 Are the games or are the metaverse? 528 00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:36,440 I don't know. 529 00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:40,520 Is every game a metaverse? 530 00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:45,480 Does that just mean all games are metaverses? 531 00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:52,640 It feels like it diminishes the term of it. 532 00:44:52,640 --> 00:45:02,640 Also I feel like it diminishes the concept of metaverses, plural. 533 00:45:02,640 --> 00:45:15,160 Because you can't, there's no obvious stopping point on the point on when it's no longer a metaverse. 534 00:45:15,160 --> 00:45:28,640 So it's why my mental model often goes to someday it's just going to be metaverse singular. 535 00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:38,000 And then you don't have to have these highly theoretical discussions of is this a game, or 536 00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:39,000 is this a metaverse? 537 00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:40,000 Is this a virtual world? 538 00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:41,000 Is this a metaverse? 539 00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:43,920 Is this social media or is it a metaverse? 540 00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:52,480 Seems unhelpful, not particularly clear. 541 00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:57,120 And things that are unhelpful, frameworks are unhelpful and not particularly clear and don't 542 00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:04,480 drive any particular changes in behavior possibly might be not perfectly fine-tuned to the 543 00:46:04,480 --> 00:46:08,280 environment. 544 00:46:08,280 --> 00:46:14,960 Then we have the ones in our spaces, you know, the central and crypto console, some in other 545 00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:24,720 side, all of these that tend to be NFT based for the land assets. 546 00:46:24,720 --> 00:46:32,920 We do tend to have a centralized rendering delivery system. 547 00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:40,280 We'll talk about that in the very last session of the course. 548 00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:42,320 Here's my game slide. 549 00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:45,520 Is it a game or is it a metaverse? 550 00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:46,840 It doesn't matter. 551 00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:47,840 Right? 552 00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:54,840 Does that mean none of these things matter? 553 00:46:54,840 --> 00:47:00,120 Instead of fighting what exactly is or isn't a metaverse, 554 00:47:00,120 --> 00:47:05,920 if you go to the generic definition that it is, the internet with better visualization 555 00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:11,840 and persistent digital objects starts to get interesting. 556 00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:17,680 You sidestep all these questions. 557 00:47:17,680 --> 00:47:20,360 Let's talk about openness for a second. 558 00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:23,920 We'll talk about a lot more in session 12. 559 00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:28,280 That's why I haven't got into great detail here 560 00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:37,560 but I think it is useful to at least touch upon it a little bit. 561 00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:40,440 All of these are versions of openness. 562 00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:45,600 Some of them more open than others, I think. 563 00:47:45,600 --> 00:47:48,160 Let's start at the top. 564 00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:49,160 Interoperability. 565 00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:55,240 All of the big closed metaverses are going to talk about this. 566 00:47:55,240 --> 00:47:56,240 Why? 567 00:47:56,240 --> 00:48:03,320 Because partially for PR reasons, regulators like interoperability, and so 568 00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:10,560 nobody is going to come say, I don't want to be interoperable with others. 569 00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:16,880 There are also cases where interoperability helps the big guys because they can absorb 570 00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:18,880 other users. 571 00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:29,280 And so expect from the big closed platforms, none of them are going to say that they're 572 00:48:29,280 --> 00:48:30,280 closed. 573 00:48:30,280 --> 00:48:39,360 What they're going to say is "we are absolutely in favor of interoperability". 574 00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:46,160 That interoperability, of course, is going to be driven through closed systems and some 575 00:48:46,160 --> 00:48:49,200 interaction models with closed systems. 576 00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:57,040 And usually what happens in this case is there's a game to make it easy to come into 577 00:48:57,040 --> 00:49:08,840 your world or application or what have you, and make it hard or inconvenient to leave. 578 00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:21,480 This is usually how people deal with interoperability. 579 00:49:21,480 --> 00:49:26,840 Let's say that is the absolute bottom layer of openness. 580 00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:37,040 Let's say the next layer, which is where most of the activity today is in the space. 581 00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:43,920 This is like a kind of five step model. 582 00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:47,760 A lot of people say, yeah, no, all your digital objects. 583 00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:54,040 Your land in, fill-in-the-bank is an NFT. 584 00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:56,040 We can't take it from you. 585 00:49:56,040 --> 00:49:57,880 So that's good. 586 00:49:57,880 --> 00:50:02,320 It's certainly better and from my opinion, better than the alternative. 587 00:50:02,320 --> 00:50:11,040 But also, this usually comes with a bunch of terms and conditions. 588 00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:16,080 If you want to play this object in our world, you got to do these things or we can kick 589 00:50:16,080 --> 00:50:21,520 you out, which is different than saying, you know, Bitcoin. 590 00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:27,040 Bitcoin does not come with terms and conditions like Bitcoin. 591 00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:32,720 No one can kick you out of the Bitcoin world. 592 00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:33,720 Next topic. 593 00:50:33,720 --> 00:50:34,720 Governance models. 594 00:50:34,720 --> 00:50:37,720 Is someone in charge? 595 00:50:37,720 --> 00:50:43,640 Some of the metaverse NFT/metaverse platforms, games, etc. 596 00:50:43,640 --> 00:50:47,520 It's very clear there's a company in charge. 597 00:50:47,520 --> 00:50:53,680 They make the decisions and you play as a customer in effect. 598 00:50:53,680 --> 00:51:04,080 Some others have some form of partially decentralized governments where different districts can 599 00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:13,320 make decisions for themselves, but they do still, I think, fall within broader top-level 600 00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:16,960 governments. 601 00:51:16,960 --> 00:51:17,960 Next topic, what's the client? 602 00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:22,880 You know, what's the client and what's the server, do the client and the server go together? 603 00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:28,040 You know, some folks are trying to do open the Web3 types of servers, what we need in 604 00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:29,040 the browser. 605 00:51:29,040 --> 00:51:32,880 There's a some downsides, you know, that infrastructure is more developed to doing it 606 00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:36,280 with one of the gaming platforms 607 00:51:36,280 --> 00:51:43,880 but browsers are more open 608 00:51:43,880 --> 00:51:46,880 as a endpoint. 609 00:51:46,880 --> 00:51:53,880 I think nobody has right now, there's multiple rendering environments. 610 00:51:53,880 --> 00:52:04,400 Like on all these, you have to go, even the ones who have open clients and ownership of 611 00:52:04,400 --> 00:52:16,480 digital objects as NFTs, there's still a form of interoperability as opposed to being 612 00:52:16,480 --> 00:52:19,480 fully decentralized and open 613 00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:23,480 and if it's fully decentralized and open, again, the rental model is Bitcoin; anyone can run 614 00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:32,480 a Bitcoin client, anyone can run a Bitcoin miner, you don't have to go to Bitcoin.com to 615 00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:34,480 do something. 616 00:52:34,480 --> 00:52:45,440 Today, every one of the platforms, you have to go to a platform-name.com or.io to run 617 00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:46,440 a Bitcoin miner. 618 00:52:46,440 --> 00:52:48,440 It is a point of centralization. 619 00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:51,440 It's a point of not censorship-resistant. 620 00:52:51,440 --> 00:52:56,440 Everything we've got in the whole sale, I can't get one, but you can take them and rebuild 621 00:52:56,440 --> 00:52:58,440 them somewhere else, and yeah, that's fine. 622 00:52:58,440 --> 00:53:01,440 But that's some more interoperability. 623 00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:03,440 It's the last... 624 00:53:03,440 --> 00:53:07,440 What I'd like to see, or I'd like to get to it, is I might not get to, which is why I'm 625 00:53:07,440 --> 00:53:10,440 not saying all of these things yet, because it's not. 626 00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:12,440 I hope to get them. 627 00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:14,440 It's not today. 628 00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:20,440 So, is that anyone can do any of these things? 629 00:53:20,440 --> 00:53:22,440 Like the Internet. 630 00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:29,440 There is not one place you can have a website. 631 00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:37,440 Even if it's on popular website, confidential systems, WordPress, there's not one place 632 00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:39,440 where you can run WordPress. 633 00:53:39,440 --> 00:53:45,440 You can host your site on WordPress.org. 634 00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:53,440 But if you also download WordPress Self-Reserving chosen, you can run the WordPress software 635 00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:54,440 by yourself. 636 00:53:54,440 --> 00:53:58,440 You don't need anyone's permission to do this. 637 00:53:58,440 --> 00:54:04,440 There is no global governance governing one WordPress site. 638 00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:08,440 There's not one company that owns all the WordPress sites. 639 00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:10,440 It's all right. 640 00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:15,440 And this is, I guess, metaverse is going to be exactly WordPress? No, but it's a useful 641 00:54:15,440 --> 00:54:16,440 example to think about. 642 00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:19,440 Are there centralized companies that are built on top of WordPress? Sure 643 00:54:19,440 --> 00:54:22,440 Are some of them variable? 644 00:54:22,440 --> 00:54:23,440 Sure. 645 00:54:23,440 --> 00:54:25,440 Is WordPress centralized? 646 00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:27,440 No, it's not. 647 00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:28,440 It's open. 648 00:54:28,440 --> 00:54:29,440 It's decentralized. 649 00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:37,440 So, I think these are things we'll talk about more in four weeks, but I do want to, like, 650 00:54:37,440 --> 00:54:40,440 introduce them to the discussion. 651 00:54:40,440 --> 00:55:04,440 Now, let me pause there because I'm on one hour and three minutes. 652 00:55:04,440 --> 00:55:12,440 So, we'll switch to questions. 653 00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:20,440 But I do think the three big takeaways, I would say, the is a new found interest in the 654 00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:21,440 metaverse. 655 00:55:21,440 --> 00:55:28,440 Anyways, multiple potential frameworks on what THE metaverse or A metaverse is, 656 00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:31,440 and there's multiple different candidates over the years of things that could have been 657 00:55:31,440 --> 00:55:34,440 or might have been metaverses. 658 00:55:34,440 --> 00:55:40,440 And I think all of these are works in progress and a space where I think it's going to evolve 659 00:55:40,440 --> 00:55:41,440 very quickly. 660 00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:46,440 In five, ten, fifteen, twenty years, we're going to have a different framework on these 661 00:55:46,440 --> 00:55:47,440 topics. 662 00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:55,440 So, let me open up my chat so I can see 663 00:55:55,440 --> 00:56:02,440 and then I'll switch to questions. 664 00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:28,440 665 00:56:28,440 --> 00:56:31,440 666 00:56:31,440 --> 00:56:34,440 667 00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:38,440 668 00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:46,440 669 00:56:46,440 --> 00:57:04,440 670 00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:05,440 Okay. 671 00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:06,440 First question. 672 00:57:06,440 --> 00:57:09,440 "Why doesn't your definition include decentralized platforms? 673 00:57:09,440 --> 00:57:11,440 It's so important." 674 00:57:11,440 --> 00:57:13,440 Yeah, I agree. 675 00:57:13,440 --> 00:57:22,440 I'm running around, tweeting all day long about the open metaverse. 676 00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:29,440 But I need to be in touch and honest in this presentation because it is perfectly possible 677 00:57:29,440 --> 00:57:36,440 that the open metaverse doesn't happen. 678 00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:44,440 I hope that's not the case. 679 00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:49,440 I'm spending an infinite amount of time hoping it does happen. 680 00:57:49,440 --> 00:57:53,440 But the metaverse could exist 681 00:57:53,440 --> 00:57:56,440 that is closed. 682 00:57:56,440 --> 00:57:59,440 And I think it would still be a metaverse. 683 00:57:59,440 --> 00:58:01,440 It would be a closed metaverse. 684 00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:03,440 I'd be less happy about it, but there is no reason why it couldn't exist 685 00:58:03,440 --> 00:58:10,440 So, me, as 6529 believe in open metaverse. 686 00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:18,440 Me as someone running your presentation on what a metaverse is, I don't think it is by definition 687 00:58:18,440 --> 00:58:19,440 decentralized. 688 00:58:19,440 --> 00:58:21,440 An open metaverse might be. 689 00:58:21,440 --> 00:58:22,440 Right? 690 00:58:22,440 --> 00:58:26,440 That's why I added the slide on open. 691 00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:33,440 "The Giaglis Framework seems to bridge metaverse with a Web3 ethos. 692 00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:35,440 Is that the intention? 693 00:58:35,440 --> 00:58:37,440 Because not all visions of the metaverse do this." 694 00:58:37,440 --> 00:58:40,440 Yeah, now I noticed that when I read it. 695 00:58:40,440 --> 00:58:46,440 George is a crypto person, has been for a very long time. 696 00:58:46,440 --> 00:58:49,440 And so, 697 00:58:49,440 --> 00:58:56,440 I am not surprised that there is a Web3 ethos embedded in his metaverse framework. 698 00:58:56,440 --> 00:59:04,440 And I think a lot of people who do not come from this Web3/Crypto aspect 699 00:59:04,440 --> 00:59:19,440 do not include those parameters at all 700 00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:26,440 So, I'm glad he has included them. 701 00:59:26,440 --> 00:59:36,440 Does the 6529 framework believe they will be connected? 702 00:59:36,440 --> 00:59:37,440 Well, I hope so. 703 00:59:37,440 --> 00:59:41,440 I hope the basis, I'm parking this until week 12 704 00:59:41,440 --> 00:59:44,440 because week 12, I'm going to be a little bit more personal. 705 00:59:44,440 --> 00:59:49,440 And a week eight, I'm trying to be a little bit more neutral 706 00:59:49,440 --> 00:59:50,440 I guess. 707 00:59:50,440 --> 00:59:58,440 My view is that we 708 00:59:58,440 --> 01:00:02,440 have a mechanism to make them interoperable. 709 01:00:02,440 --> 01:00:06,440 and that mechanism is a kind of tease. 710 01:00:06,440 --> 01:00:15,440 And instead of having some large organizations decide on interoperability standards, 711 01:00:15,440 --> 01:00:21,440 but fundamentally work in closed 712 01:00:21,440 --> 01:00:27,440 environments. 713 01:00:27,440 --> 01:00:32,440 714 01:00:32,440 --> 01:00:36,440 NFTs are fundamentally open environment 715 01:00:36,440 --> 01:00:38,440 and then people can build on top of them 716 01:00:38,440 --> 01:00:40,440 but I want to talk about that in the week 12. 717 01:00:40,440 --> 01:00:45,440 There were heading away from. 718 01:00:45,440 --> 01:00:48,440 An objective understanding of the situation to my personal belief 719 01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:52,440 on what would be better. 720 01:00:52,440 --> 01:00:55,440 "What is the overlap between the concepts of metaverse and cryptocurrency?" 721 01:00:55,440 --> 01:01:01,440 Well, if you want a 722 01:01:01,440 --> 01:01:03,440 closed metaverse, you don't need any. 723 01:01:03,440 --> 01:01:05,440 You can run a close metaverse where 724 01:01:05,440 --> 01:01:10,440 people own the game objects, but in 725 01:01:10,440 --> 01:01:14,440 Epic's database, people can pay for them with credits in 726 01:01:14,440 --> 01:01:17,440 Epic's database. 727 01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:24,440 728 01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:28,440 729 01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:31,440 A lot of companies are going to do that, to be honest. 730 01:01:31,440 --> 01:01:35,440 So, 731 01:01:35,440 --> 01:01:37,440 if you want an open 732 01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:39,440 metaverse 733 01:01:39,440 --> 01:01:46,440 with not one party in charge with not one person's database in charge. 734 01:01:46,440 --> 01:01:57,440 Well, then you need something that's on a database and that's really a blockchain and specifically a public blockchain, which is what we call a cryptocurrency or crypto asset. 735 01:01:57,440 --> 01:02:02,440 So, that is a good question. 736 01:02:02,440 --> 01:02:08,440 I thought there was a social aspect to the metaverse versus just the 3D space, but it wasn't included in the definitions. 737 01:02:08,440 --> 01:02:11,440 This is a very good point 738 01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:15,440 and we need to think about it. 739 01:02:15,440 --> 01:02:20,440 That needs to get on the slide somewhere. 740 01:02:20,440 --> 01:02:22,440 Yeah, for sure 741 01:02:22,440 --> 01:02:23,440 there's a social aspect 742 01:02:23,440 --> 01:02:26,440 and it's kind of implicitly there 743 01:02:26,440 --> 01:02:28,440 and it should be made explicitly there, 744 01:02:28,440 --> 01:02:34,440 I mean, one mental model that I sometimes have 745 01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:36,440 are 746 01:02:36,440 --> 01:02:43,440 metaverses just social networks 747 01:02:43,440 --> 01:02:46,440 with just different visualizations. 748 01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:49,440 But overall, those are social networks. 749 01:02:49,440 --> 01:02:58,440 I don't know. 750 01:02:58,440 --> 01:03:03,440 But we need to put a slide in there, which says this 751 01:03:03,440 --> 01:03:06,440 explicitly. 752 01:03:06,440 --> 01:03:17,440 High risk that large companies get to set the rules for metaverse, is that a threat or a possibility in your opinion. Yes, in fact, the whole reason 6529 exists is that I think that 753 01:03:17,440 --> 01:03:19,440 that is a very high risk. 754 01:03:19,440 --> 01:03:21,440 I think that is the default case. 755 01:03:21,440 --> 01:03:25,440 I think the default case is that 756 01:03:25,440 --> 01:03:32,440 metaverses will become like Web2, they will be centralized in 5, 10, 15, 20 companies 757 01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:34,440 and I think that's about outcome, 758 01:03:34,440 --> 01:03:45,440 and that's my personal opinion. I don't think that's an objective view about the metaverse someone might have. Someone from Meta might think it's better not to be that way. 759 01:03:45,440 --> 01:03:48,440 I mean, to be that way, but, 760 01:03:48,440 --> 01:03:51,440 for sure I think it's worse. 761 01:03:51,440 --> 01:04:03,440 "Do you believe in a future of the concept of land and gravity in metaverse? To me, they seem like artificial limitations of limit the entry barrier as people are familiar with 762 01:04:03,440 --> 01:04:06,440 these concepts." 763 01:04:06,440 --> 01:04:15,440 Well, I mean, 764 01:04:15,440 --> 01:04:23,440 I hear this fairly often. 765 01:04:23,440 --> 01:04:33,440 From people who are 766 01:04:33,440 --> 01:04:35,440 very deep into the space. 767 01:04:35,440 --> 01:04:39,440 And as hell these things are just total skill morphism. 768 01:04:39,440 --> 01:04:42,440 They're limitations. 769 01:04:42,440 --> 01:04:45,440 We don't need to stick to the land concept. 770 01:04:45,440 --> 01:04:50,440 We don't need to stick to the human scale concept. 771 01:04:50,440 --> 01:04:58,440 And I appreciate that in theory 772 01:04:58,440 --> 01:05:01,440 now, without a counter argument 773 01:05:01,440 --> 01:05:04,440 which is the following. 774 01:05:04,440 --> 01:05:07,440 The counter argument is, 775 01:05:07,440 --> 01:05:14,440 almost we've been making video games for several decades now 776 01:05:14,440 --> 01:05:20,440 a,nd those video games 777 01:05:20,440 --> 01:05:22,440 have been 778 01:05:22,440 --> 01:05:25,440 overwhelmingly 779 01:05:25,440 --> 01:05:28,440 780 01:05:28,440 --> 01:05:46,440 skeuomorphic with land and gravity and things of that nature. 781 01:05:46,440 --> 01:05:59,440 I think there is something to that, 782 01:05:59,440 --> 01:06:07,440 I don't think it's accidental 783 01:06:07,440 --> 01:06:17,440 that almost all games match these types of models. I don't think it's an accident. 784 01:06:17,440 --> 01:06:22,440 I also have 785 01:06:22,440 --> 01:06:28,440 seen attempts to make hugely conceptual spaces 786 01:06:28,440 --> 01:06:31,440 and every attempt I've seen so far, 787 01:06:31,440 --> 01:06:34,440 has been kind of junk. 788 01:06:34,440 --> 01:06:37,440 Now, maybe the space is really good, but the problem is like 789 01:06:37,440 --> 01:06:40,440 our mental models are stuck on 790 01:06:40,440 --> 01:06:43,440 things looking a little bit like the real world. 791 01:06:43,440 --> 01:06:44,440 Maybe. 792 01:06:44,440 --> 01:06:47,440 But it's kind of six and one and a half dozen of the other. 793 01:06:47,440 --> 01:06:48,440 It's. 794 01:06:48,440 --> 01:06:50,440 795 01:06:58,440 --> 01:07:02,440 I have yet to see one where it works. 796 01:07:02,440 --> 01:07:04,440 So in theory, 797 01:07:04,440 --> 01:07:08,440 yes, these are official limitations and we can do whatever we want, 798 01:07:08,440 --> 01:07:09,440 and practice, 799 01:07:09,440 --> 01:07:11,440 whatever we want. 800 01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:13,440 So far has ended up looking 801 01:07:13,440 --> 01:07:15,440 kind of like the real world. 802 01:07:15,440 --> 01:07:16,440 Now, not exactly like the real world but, 803 01:07:16,440 --> 01:07:19,440 there's gravity in home, for example, but not a lot of gravity, 804 01:07:19,440 --> 01:07:21,440 you can jump really high. 805 01:07:21,440 --> 01:07:27,440 So 806 01:07:27,440 --> 01:07:33,440 to prove it otherwise, 807 01:07:33,440 --> 01:07:37,440 I would expect most things will somehow correlate with real world 808 01:07:37,440 --> 01:07:38,440 concepts. 809 01:07:38,440 --> 01:07:40,440 "Thoughts on digital twins using the metaverse." 810 01:07:40,440 --> 01:07:44,440 So digital twins are a digital representation of something in the 811 01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:45,440 physical world, 812 01:07:45,440 --> 01:07:48,440 and they came out of the world of like 813 01:07:48,440 --> 01:07:51,440 high end equipment manufacturing and so on. 814 01:07:51,440 --> 01:07:55,440 And so you have like a turbine and you make a physical copy of the turbine and 815 01:07:55,440 --> 01:07:58,440 you put on the physical turbine sensors 816 01:07:58,440 --> 01:08:02,440 and those sensors feed data to the digital twin 817 01:08:02,440 --> 01:08:05,440 and so you can watch and monitor, 818 01:08:05,440 --> 01:08:07,440 the 819 01:08:07,440 --> 01:08:09,440 turbine 820 01:08:09,440 --> 01:08:11,440 during 821 01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:13,440 In the digital world. 822 01:08:13,440 --> 01:08:14,440 And you know 823 01:08:14,440 --> 01:08:16,440 say, oh, look, there's 824 01:08:16,440 --> 01:08:17,440 data is coming out of line, 825 01:08:17,440 --> 01:08:19,440 the turbines are not behaving normally, 826 01:08:19,440 --> 01:08:22,440 let's go fix it in the physical world before it breaks. 827 01:08:22,440 --> 01:08:23,440 Now there's other use cases too 828 01:08:23,440 --> 01:08:27,440 I think in time you'll have cities where you'll see full in some 829 01:08:27,440 --> 01:08:30,440 cities, there are cities with digital twins, but they'll get better where 830 01:08:30,440 --> 01:08:35,440 you'll say, look, we're monitoring traffic flows and pollution and waste 831 01:08:35,440 --> 01:08:38,440 water and disease spread. 832 01:08:38,440 --> 01:08:41,440 Absolutely is going to exist 833 01:08:41,440 --> 01:08:46,440 I think for 834 01:08:46,440 --> 01:08:48,440 kind of boring 835 01:08:48,440 --> 01:08:54,440 I'm sorry, not boring, what is the word I'm looking for. 836 01:08:54,440 --> 01:08:56,440 Institutional use. 837 01:08:56,440 --> 01:08:59,440 Not like hanging out fun social use actually think digital twins are going 838 01:08:59,440 --> 01:09:01,440 to be very important 839 01:09:01,440 --> 01:09:04,440 because they will give us 840 01:09:04,440 --> 01:09:07,440 a viable 841 01:09:07,440 --> 01:09:10,440 model 842 01:09:10,440 --> 01:09:13,440 to improve the real world and monitor the real world better. 843 01:09:13,440 --> 01:09:15,440 So I'm fairly bullish on these as a concept 844 01:09:15,440 --> 01:09:18,440 I can't an architecture. 845 01:09:18,440 --> 01:09:20,440 How do we protect these from being copied? 846 01:09:20,440 --> 01:09:25,440 I don't think it's easy to be honest. 847 01:09:25,440 --> 01:09:27,440 Just like anything else on the Internet, 848 01:09:27,440 --> 01:09:30,440 how do you protect them from being copied? 849 01:09:30,440 --> 01:09:32,440 Not that easily. 850 01:09:32,440 --> 01:09:35,440 So what do you have to aim for? 851 01:09:35,440 --> 01:09:37,440 Well, the same, 852 01:09:37,440 --> 01:09:40,440 I mean, it's a version of right click. 853 01:09:40,440 --> 01:09:48,440 And so you're going to have to have some concept of 854 01:09:48,440 --> 01:09:51,440 providence 855 01:09:51,440 --> 01:09:55,440 for that 856 01:09:55,440 --> 01:09:58,440 857 01:09:58,440 --> 01:10:01,440 not to be a big issue. 858 01:10:01,440 --> 01:10:05,440 But I do think like, if you make a cool looking building somewhere 859 01:10:05,440 --> 01:10:07,440 might someone copy it somewhere else? 860 01:10:07,440 --> 01:10:11,440 yeah, I think that one comes. 861 01:10:11,440 --> 01:10:15,440 I don't see it obviously for it not to happen 862 01:10:15,440 --> 01:10:21,440 so I think given what we've learned from NFTs, 863 01:10:21,440 --> 01:10:23,440 if 864 01:10:23,440 --> 01:10:27,440 X copy makes some cool X copy building 865 01:10:27,440 --> 01:10:31,440 and there are 1000 tokens of that X copy building 866 01:10:31,440 --> 01:10:36,440 and 867 01:10:36,440 --> 01:10:40,440 you own one of those, 868 01:10:40,440 --> 01:10:42,440 that's going to be different 869 01:10:42,440 --> 01:10:47,440 and more valuable than someone who just right clicked saved your X copy building. 870 01:10:47,440 --> 01:10:56,440 So I suspect we're going to have to use the same frameworks and mental models that we use for digital art for digital buildings. 871 01:10:56,440 --> 01:10:58,440 I don't see any other 872 01:10:58,440 --> 01:11:01,440 way around it. 873 01:11:01,440 --> 01:11:09,440 You want provenance and tokenization 874 01:11:09,440 --> 01:11:15,440 to manage this topic. 875 01:11:15,440 --> 01:11:19,440 There's a question that I don't have about the slightest idea what it means 876 01:11:19,440 --> 01:11:22,440 or how to answer it but I'm going to read it because it's amuzing. 877 01:11:22,440 --> 01:11:28,440 "Is a metaverse a way of function with multiple potentials with collapsing one through observation? 878 01:11:28,440 --> 01:11:34,440 I think quantum computers will drastically change the metaverse definitions." 879 01:11:34,440 --> 01:11:38,440 I kind of understand the words 880 01:11:38,440 --> 01:11:41,440 and sort of the concepts behind this 881 01:11:41,440 --> 01:11:44,440 I just don't have any idea how to answer this question. 882 01:11:44,440 --> 01:11:47,440 So I didn't think it would be hard to read it for everyone 883 01:11:47,440 --> 01:11:52,440 in case it's helpful for anyone else. 884 01:11:52,440 --> 01:11:55,440 "What's the best book you've read about constructs?" 885 01:11:55,440 --> 01:11:58,440 I mean the classic book on this right is Snow Crash, 886 01:11:58,440 --> 01:12:03,440 everyone starts there. 887 01:12:03,440 --> 01:12:09,440 Actually I think a book that people don't think of as directly being a metaverse book. 888 01:12:09,440 --> 01:12:12,440 It is kind of a metaverse book. 889 01:12:12,440 --> 01:12:22,440 A mixed reality metaverse book is the series of 890 01:12:22,440 --> 01:12:32,440 Demon and Freedom. 891 01:12:32,440 --> 01:12:37,440 So, 892 01:12:37,440 --> 01:12:42,440 it's interesting because it's basically a gaming platform. 893 01:12:42,440 --> 01:12:47,440 Like wild and started. 894 01:12:47,440 --> 01:12:50,440 Impacting behavior in the real world, 895 01:12:50,440 --> 01:12:55,440 and it is a form of metaverse, 896 01:12:55,440 --> 01:12:59,440 I think. 897 01:12:59,440 --> 01:13:02,440 A kind of an abstract form of metaverse like some of these ones we're talking about 898 01:13:02,440 --> 01:13:09,440 so I threw it out there not because it's... 899 01:13:09,440 --> 01:13:12,440 it's not a classic book of the genre 900 01:13:12,440 --> 01:13:18,440 but I think there's a mental model that you could view it there and I find it's interesting. 901 01:13:18,440 --> 01:13:21,440 "Aren't you afraid that the metaverse will become a trap? 902 01:13:21,440 --> 01:13:24,440 A.I. and robotics throw us from offices 903 01:13:24,440 --> 01:13:26,440 there'll be nothing to do. 904 01:13:26,440 --> 01:13:31,440 The metaverse can be such a golden cage to socialize and entertain us." 905 01:13:31,440 --> 01:13:35,440 Well, I mean 906 01:13:35,440 --> 01:13:38,440 I'm not sure I believe the premises of this question. 907 01:13:38,440 --> 01:13:45,440 But, if A.I. and robotics start doing all the work for us, 908 01:13:45,440 --> 01:13:50,440 we probably will hang out in the metaverse more. 909 01:13:50,440 --> 01:13:54,440 I know this question is written with a value judgment in it. 910 01:13:54,440 --> 01:13:56,440 But, 911 01:13:56,440 --> 01:13:59,440 maybe the value judgment is opposite. 912 01:13:59,440 --> 01:14:02,440 Maybe if the machines do all of our 913 01:14:02,440 --> 01:14:04,440 work for us 914 01:14:04,440 --> 01:14:09,440 we can be the people focused on 915 01:14:09,440 --> 01:14:12,440 self development and self expression. 916 01:14:12,440 --> 01:14:15,440 I'm a little skeptical of how that will play out. 917 01:14:15,440 --> 01:14:18,440 It hasn't played out and I'm 918 01:14:18,440 --> 01:14:23,440 actually not sure it's super healthy for humans not to have challenges 919 01:14:23,440 --> 01:14:27,440 so I don't know if it's going to play out that way. 920 01:14:27,440 --> 01:14:35,440 But yeah, I mean conceivably in the world that the A.I.s are good enough to do all our work, 921 01:14:35,440 --> 01:14:40,440 but not good enough to get rid of us, 922 01:14:40,440 --> 01:14:44,440 will we keep ourselves, or to frame it differently, 923 01:14:44,440 --> 01:14:49,440 keep ourselves more occupied with social activities from people around the world? 924 01:14:49,440 --> 01:14:51,440 Sure. 925 01:14:51,440 --> 01:14:53,440 Is that metaverse a golden cage? 926 01:14:53,440 --> 01:14:54,440 Maybe 927 01:14:54,440 --> 01:14:56,440 but like 928 01:14:56,440 --> 01:15:01,440 I don't know if there's any more of a golden cage than Twitter is today. 929 01:15:01,440 --> 01:15:03,440 And some people say, oh, putters not. 930 01:15:03,440 --> 01:15:08,440 It's taking people away from real life. 931 01:15:08,440 --> 01:15:15,440 932 01:15:15,440 --> 01:15:25,440 933 01:15:25,440 --> 01:15:30,440 Do you see our visual one largely the same as we come up on a year of their deal? 934 01:15:30,440 --> 01:15:31,440 Yeah 935 01:15:31,440 --> 01:15:32,440 more or less exactly the same 936 01:15:32,440 --> 01:15:34,440 I'll talk about it more in week 12 937 01:15:34,440 --> 01:15:39,440 and I want to make the session more general. 938 01:15:39,440 --> 01:15:44,440 Okay, I think we're an hour and a half. 939 01:15:44,440 --> 01:15:46,440 Let's wrap it here. 940 01:15:46,440 --> 01:15:49,440 Thank you as always for joining. 941 01:15:49,440 --> 01:15:52,440 We'll make the announcements in a little bit about 942 01:15:52,440 --> 01:15:57,440 regional and course logistics a little bit so we can start getting the guests back and coming. 943 01:15:57,440 --> 01:16:03,440 There's just an awful lot going on and the teams are doing a great job 944 01:16:03,440 --> 01:16:04,440 working on things. 945 01:16:04,440 --> 01:16:09,440 So we're just going to give ourselves a little bit more breathing room to get everything done. 946 01:16:09,440 --> 01:16:11,440 Can anyone build them on the other? 947 01:16:11,440 --> 01:16:12,440 You need to. 948 01:16:12,440 --> 01:16:15,440 Can anyone can use a space and put NFT's in it. 949 01:16:15,440 --> 01:16:18,440 If you want to design spaces, you do need some 950 01:16:18,440 --> 01:16:22,440 experience and 3D modeling, but if you have that, yes, you can do that. 951 01:16:22,440 --> 01:16:24,440 All right, everyone. 952 01:16:24,440 --> 01:16:27,440 Thank you so much as always. 953 01:16:27,440 --> 01:16:30,440 And I'll see you back on Twitter. 954 01:16:30,440 --> 01:16:34,440 Sure.